{"id":41581,"date":"2022-03-17T16:17:56","date_gmt":"2022-03-17T15:17:56","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/elgarajedefrank.es\/?p=41581"},"modified":"2024-02-07T18:54:56","modified_gmt":"2024-02-07T17:54:56","slug":"interview-the-sea-at-midnight","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/elgarajedefrank.es\/en\/interview-the-sea-at-midnight\/","title":{"rendered":"Interview: The Sea at Midnight"},"content":{"rendered":"

The Sea At Midnight, a dreamy darkwave project from California, inundated our lives just a couple of years ago, leaving a trail of melancholy behind. His first album, released during the awful 2020, was one of the only positive things of that year, as we saw in it a ray of hope in the middle of the general sadness. Today finally, it’s Vince Grant who talks about his music in this interesting and deep interview. His new album will be released on the 1st of April<\/strong>, but meanwhile we can listen to his latest EP Oceans.\u00a0<\/em><\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Header photo: Anastasia Paveloff<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

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Photo: Kara Gray<\/p><\/div>\n

\u2014In the past you played in some bands, as you have commented in some interviews. Can you please tell us more about this? Did you record any material with them?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014The first band I joined was when I was in college. I had no musical experience. Didn\u2019t play an instrument and had no formal vocal training. Did take a folk guitar class in high school, but I was terrible. Had no aptitude for it and didn\u2019t particularly enjoy it either, so after that class ended didn\u2019t continue playing. Years later in college I was at a show and a guy walks up to me at the bar and says, \u201cI want you to be the singer in my band.\u201d. I was completely taken by surprise. Had no idea who this person was and had never sung in a band before. To have a complete stranger ask me to be the singer in their band was so random and it threw me off for a second. After getting my bearings, responded that I didn\u2019t think I was the person for the job as I\u2019d never sung, at least in public, but he said that they were an original band and needed someone to write the lyrics. He asked, \u201cYou write poetry, don\u2019t you?\u201d It was actually more of a statement than a question. At the time I was fond of wearing a khaki-green trench coat around campus a la Ian Curtis with a Joy Division<\/strong> pin, so think he had me pegged as a wannabe poet. He also told me the other guys in the band had seen me at shows around town and wearing tee shirts on campus of bands they liked, so they thought I\u2019d be a good fit. Replied that I did in fact write poetry and he said why don\u2019t you just bring your poetry book to the rehearsal space and have a go. A few days later showed up at their rehearsal space with my poetry book and there was a microphone, two guitar players, a bassist and a drummer. They played their original songs and I sang what would become the basis for my first lyrics out of my poetry book. After that initial jam session, they said I was in and that was how this whole musical journey began for me. It was sort of songwriter by fire as here I was in my first band and immediately thrust into the role of lyricist and writing songs from that very first rehearsal.<\/span><\/p>\n

After college I moved back to Chicago, where I\u2019m originally from, and joined another original band as just the singer. Their songs were already written, so they didn\u2019t need any help in that area. My band from college had played a few shows with them in Chicago and they asked me to join as they needed a new vocalist. After college, at the age of 23, I bought my first guitar and started writing my own songs while in this band. Eventually I brought some of my original compositions to them and we started playing a couple of them live.<\/span><\/p>\n

In regards to recordings of my earlier work, back in those days you recorded \u201cdemo tapes\u201d and everything was on cassette. Was in two bands later on that put out EPs on CD. This was all in the pre-streaming stone age. Think there are a few old cassettes and CDs somewhere in my parents\u2019 basement.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014You were living in New York and Los Angeles in the late eighties and beginning of the 90s. How was your life back then?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

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Photo: Liauna Tolmasoff<\/p><\/div>\n

\u2014After the band in Chicago broke up, had a batch of songs I\u2019d written and wanted to form a band to play them. I\u2019d been showing them to my brother Chris, who\u2019s a great guitar player, and he wanted to be in the band with me, but we both wanted to move on from Chicago so we headed to Los Angeles. We arrived in Los Angeles in 1989 and it was wild. At the time hair metal was all the rage in LA and the dominant musical scene. Guns and Roses<\/strong> were huge and the Sunset Strip was like Mardi Gras every night. Bands were playing every night and packs of rockers roamed the strip going in and out of the Whiskey-A-Go-Go, the Roxy, Gazarri\u2019s, the Rainbow. We got there in May and that first summer we busked on Venice Beach playing my songs. We both played acoustic guitar and Chris played some harmonica as well. We got an apartment in Venice and it\u2019s amazing to think that back in those times a couple of broke musicians could afford to live in Venice Beach. For a couple of guys from Chicago suddenly living six blocks from the ocean, it was pretty surreal. People who saw us busking on the Venice boardwalk booked us for acoustic shows at bars, coffee shops and parties. Once we were on the local acoustic circuit, we started meeting other musicians and formed a five-piece rock band. I was the songwriter, but live was just the frontman, only playing acoustic on a couple of the slower numbers. Our band became somewhat popular and for three straight years we played over a hundred shows per year and did some regional touring. On one of those tours, we played 48 shows in 52 days. During this time we also opened up for the Gin Blossoms<\/strong> and other bigger acts like the Sidewinders<\/strong>. I was a huge Plimsouls<\/strong> fan and we also opened for Peter Case<\/strong> a couple of times. We also recorded an EP which came to the attention of IRS Records and they ended up distributing it. There was talk that it was a test and if we did well might be signed to the label, but they closed up shop within a year.<\/span><\/p>\n

Eventually the band broke up and unfortunately by that time I was pretty much an alcoholic. My brother told me, \u201cI\u2019m tired of you drinking your pay checks\u201d and he decided to forge his own life in California without me. I had a fascination with New York, specifically the East Village. I\u2019d been there before and had fallen in love with it, so when my brother and I split up I headed for New York. Back then New York was still dirty and somewhat dangerous. It was before Times Square had been turned into a tourist Disneyland. It was all peep shows, seedy bars, drug deals. There were cab drivers who refused to go there at night. Once again, like Venice, it\u2019s crazy to think you could afford to live in the East Village back then on not much money. It was all musicians and artists of every stripe. I had my own large studio apartment off Tompkins Square Park. Iggy Pop<\/strong> lived around the corner from me and I\u2019d see him walking around the neighbourhood.<\/span><\/p>\n

In New York I didn\u2019t want to be just the singer anymore. Wanted to play electric guitar live. I temporarily joined a band as the singer\/rhythm guitar player and then set about forming my own band. I\u2019d met some musicians in the East Village and we played a couple of parties with my songs. After about a year in New York, my brother and I were talking again. I\u2019d temporarily cleaned up my act and he decided to move to New York and join me. We put together a band, made a demo tape and started playing bars and clubs all over the city. It was incredible. There were so many places to play back then. Being a gigging musician in New York was one of the most memorable periods in my life.<\/span><\/p>\n

My brother didn\u2019t particularly care for New York and we eventually moved back to Los Angeles together and put another band together, but after a couple of years I really missed New York and moved back once again alone. Never ended up putting a band together, although I did regularly play solo acoustic shows, many at the venues I\u2019d played in my previous time living there. Unfortunately, this coincided with rents skyrocketing in the city and everything was becoming prohibitively expensive. Times Square became what is is today, Greenwich Village got cleaned up and money was in the air. After a while I literally could not afford to live there anymore. At the end of that stay, I\u2019d moved out to Brooklyn and this was before the mass exodus out there from Manhattan and Brooklyn was far from the thing it is nowadays. There were no venues to play at, no record stores, no nightlife except for the local bars that had been there forever, so one more time I moved back to Los Angeles and my brother and I started yet another band. We put out an EP on CD and ended up playing gigs regularly all over Los Angeles. After a few years of playing out, recording, etc. the band eventually split up. Think that collectively we were burnt out physically and mentally. Tired of banging our heads against this industry wall that we couldn\u2019t get through or seem to scale while all the while working day jobs to stay afloat.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014For an American, you have named a lot of English influences (The Cure, Joy Division, Echo and the Bunnymen, New Order, Siouxsie and the Banshees). Any Goth American band that have influenced you?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

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Photo: Ricky Saenz<\/p><\/div>\n

\u2014I liked Christian Death<\/strong>, Swans<\/strong> and the Cruxshadows<\/strong> quite a bit. To me, early REM<\/strong> was a goth band. They are the quintessential American Southern Gothic band. The musical equivalent of William Faulkner. I loved the early REM<\/strong> releases, especially the first two albums and EP. They lost me around the fifth album, but every year I go through an REM<\/strong> phase and listen to those early releases. There is something other worldly and timeless about those first records for me.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014You met Chris King after reading an add in Craigslist. You already knew his band Cold Showers, what did you like of their music?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014First and foremost, the songs are amazing. They\u2019re this perfect mix of darkwave, coldwave and shoegaze. In addition, Chris King\u2019s production is so lush, dark and dense and I love his guitar playing. It\u2019s so creative and distinct. Coupled with Jon\u2019s unique voice, they have such an unmistakable sound that really resonates with me.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014In an interview, you said that, at that moment, you thought your days in bands were over. Why? Were you tired of working with other musicians?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014I wasn\u2019t tired of working with other musicians. More like I was tired of the grind of being a musician. Working during the day to make ends meet and trying to play music on nights and weekends. Also, spending most of my disposable income on music expenses, while not making any money from it. Plus, I was getting older and I\u2019d never had a career, just a series of jobs to make rent while pursuing music, and the realization that the music dream had probably sailed hit me pretty hard. I sold all of my equipment, quit playing music entirely and at one point didn\u2019t even own a guitar for five years. Even stopped listening to music for a couple of years because it was just too painful. I felt like a complete failure and spiralled into a deep depression that went on for a number of years. Felt like I\u2019d wasted my life or something and needed to make up for lost time. Studied to try and get into law school, then went to night school for a year to become a nurse and then to night school to pursue something in the criminal justice field, but my heart wasn\u2019t in any of it, which further exacerbated my depression.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014Your song \u201cMelancholia\u201d is about that depression you are talking about. Do you consider writing about it as part of the therapeutic process?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014Writing about depression is definitely part of the therapeutic process for me. I write songs to cope with all my afflictions. The lyrical themes of many of my songs revolve around depression and my struggles with alcohol and drug addiction. Sometimes all three.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014Back to Chris King, he brought Brandon Pierce in, right? He is doing the drum programming, how is working with him? He is more a rock drummer, isn\u2019t he?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014Chris King did bring in Brandon Pierce to do the drum programming on the debut album. It was an absolute joy working with Brandon. Playing in bands throughout the years and dealing with so many musicians, Brandon was by far one of the best experiences I\u2019ve ever had collaborating with another musician. In addition to being immensely talented and wonderfully creative, he\u2019s an incredibly nice guy. On top of that, he has a wonderful sense of humor and he didn\u2019t display an ounce of ego. He always wanted to do what was best for the song and he genuinely seemed to want me to be happy during the process. The way we worked was Chris and I would record an acoustic version of the song and email it to Brandon. He\u2019d send us back a drum track and then Chris and I would proceed to build the song from there. The first acoustic version we sent Brandon he wrote me back one line, \u201cDo you like Killing Joke<\/strong>?\u201d I definitely said and in almost no time he sent back this incredible drum track. It was just perfect. On another song we sent he wrote us back, \u201cI\u2019m feeling New Order<\/strong>\/Manchester vibes on this one.\u201d I said go for it and once again he sent back a killer drum track. You can see how easy it was to work with Brandon. I absolutely love all his drum tracks on the debut.<\/span><\/p>\n

On the new album, Chris did the drum programming. He had been doing a lot of the drum programming on his own stuff and for other clients, so he asked if he could make a first run at them, but if I didn\u2019t like them or he felt he didn\u2019t have the right idea we would get Brandon involved again, but we ended up using all of Chris\u2019 tracks. I didn\u2019t realize it while recording the first album, but turns out among his other many talents he\u2019s highly skilled at drum programming. He\u2019d bring in awesome templates and then he\u2019d ask for my input, so I had the chance to be much more involved with editing the drums and making creative decisions on things like fills, cymbal placement, patterns, etc. on the second album. It was a lot of fun. For instance, he would bring in a track with say two different patterns on a part and ask me which one I liked best. Or we\u2019d experiment with using a ride cymbal on a section versus a hi-hat pattern. Things of that nature. It was really cool to help.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014In the name of the band and also in a lot of your songs you have used the sea as a metaphor. What does it represent to you?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

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Photo: Kara Gray<\/p><\/div>\n

\u2014I\u2019ve often wondered myself what it represents for me and why I\u2019m so drawn towards it both physically and metaphorically. It\u2019s raw natural beauty just speaks to me for some reason. It\u2019s immense power and vastness. The way it looks so different at certain times of the day. Sunset, sunrise, under moonlight. Lit up under a full moon. It has many moods. It can be calm, flat or have gentle undulating waves that flow in to shore in a regular pattern as if it\u2019s in an almost meditative state, or it can be stormy, angry with thrashing waves. It\u2019s endlessly fascinating to see it under different light and weather conditions. It stirs my emotions and makes me feel things in an intense way sometimes.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014Was it easy to compose your first album? How long did it take you?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014Sometimes the songwriting process is easy and seems to come effortlessly. At other times it\u2019s slow and tortuous. Honestly can\u2019t remember how long it took me. Didn\u2019t think I was composing an album when I wrote those songs. Thought I\u2019d never record again and was just writing songs as a creative outlet to release my emotions. When I first met Chris had no intention of recording. Then we decided to do a single together. Two songs. After that we decided to do a five song EP and then we kept going and ended up with an eight song album. There wasn\u2019t ever a thought that I was writing an album. It just organically came about.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014I think that what makes The Sea At Midnight a project so special, it\u2019s that you can feel real emotions in your songs. Something that sadly doesn\u2019t happen too often. Is it difficult for you to put your feelings, show your soul in your compositions?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014It\u2019s not difficult at all for me to share my feelings in my compositions. To honestly explore my emotions is the primary reason I write songs. Sometimes it\u2019s in a therapeutic way to deal with what psychically ails me and other times it is to express positive emotions such as joy.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014For some of us, your music has been the soundtrack for this pandemic days. Do you think that in a way the songs have the same feelings of sadness and hope most of us shared at the time?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014I do tend toward melancholy. It seems to be the way I\u2019m wired. I\u2019ve never shied away from sadness. It intrigues me. As I said previously, a lot of the songs portray me grappling with lifelong depression, but there is also something inside of me, a little voice, that won\u2019t concede complete defeat. On many of my darker songs, there is still a glimmer of hope.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014Some of the songs are also about your struggles with alcohol and drug addiction. Do you think they can help other people with the same problems?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014People have actually told me many times that my songs have helped them deal with problems around alcohol and drug addiction. Others have even remarked it has helped them understand loved ones better that struggle with alcohol and drugs. The same with depression.<\/span><\/p>\n

\"\"\u2014\u201cMedicine\u201d is about ways we cope and deal with emotional pain, as you said in an interview. I guess you refer both to drugs and painkillers. As a person who had a difficult past, as you have confessed, do you think that they can sometimes be necessary or is it better to face the pain?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014There was a certain time in my life that drugs and alcohol were necessary to deal with my emotional pain, but then they turned on me and made it worse. The substances I was using to blunt and escape my pain almost killed me. At that point the only way out of my addictions was to face the pain. I can\u2019t speak for anyone else, but for me personally it was a matter of life and death. Either face the pain or risk dying if I kept drinking and using drugs.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014\u201cEdge Of The World\u201d is one of my favorite songs of the last years. You said that it\u2019s about remorse for the things you did in the past. So we could say another side of your songs is about making amends. Do you think the song has reached people you think you have wronged? Are they feeling better thanks to the song?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014I made direct amends to the people I hurt and wronged. Some people I made amends hear \u201cEdge Of The World\u201d and knew what it was about right away. They didn\u2019t specifically say they felt better because of it, but I could sense from some of them that they appreciated it. They could tell I was bothered, at times haunted, by my actions and some remarked on the sincerity of the sentiments. I never explained the meaning of the song to anyone I had or needed to make amends to, or used it as a way to make my amends. Putting a song like that out into the world definitely holds your feet to the fire, though. You can\u2019t sing one thing and then act otherwise.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014You have named as favorite writers, authors as diverse as William Gibson, Steve Erickson and Denis Johnson. Do you think they have influenced in any way your way of writing? Are you interested in fantasy and sci-fi literature?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014The way I see and perceive the world is why I\u2019ve had an affinity for those writers. It\u2019s why they speak to me. When I was younger was very interested in sci-f and fantasy. Loved the Dune series, Lord of the Rings, \u201cStranger In a Strange Land\u201d, The Hobbit. Later on authors like Ray Bradbury, Isaac Asimov, Philip K. Dick. Then on to more modern authors like Andy Weir. Think discovering William Gibson tilted me in the direction of cyberpunk and I can\u2019t read sci-fi anymore that takes place in space. Not with the fascination of Bezos, Musk and Branson and their forays. That\u2019s all based on leaving a dying Earth behind. I\u2019m more interested in how we are going to face almost certain climate catastrophe. The last few books I\u2019ve read have explored this theme, \u201cMinistry For The Future\u201c by Kim Stanley Robinson, \u201cCloud Cuckoo Land\u201d by Anthony Doerr, \u201cTermination Shock\u201d by Neal Stephenson, \u201cA Children\u2019s Bible\u201d by Lydia Millet, \u201cThe City Where We Once Lived\u201d by Eric Barnes, \u201cRoad Out of Winter\u201c by Alison Stine, \u201cLeave The World Behind\u201d by Rumaan Alam, and I\u2019m currently reading \u201cAnthem\u201d by Noah Hawley. Alison Stine has a new book out called \u201cTrashlands\u201d and think I\u2019m going to dive into that next. I\u2019ve been an avid reader my entire life. It can be a wonderful source of entertainment and escapism, but now I look for books that face the pain we\u2019ve inflicted on the Earth and what that means for us as a species.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014Your first album was remastered only a few months after the released. Can you tell us why?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

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Photo: Ricky Saenz<\/p><\/div>\n

\u2014Yes, I noticed when my songs were played on the radio or featured on playlists they came on at a lower volume than the song before them and that the song after them would also be louder than my track. Chris thought it was a mastering issue and recommended getting in touch with Patrick Hills at Earthtone Recording Company. After consulting with Patrick, he thought there was sonic headroom to push the tracks louder, so I had him remaster it. The tracks came back from Patrick with a significant volume boost.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014You are going to play in the Darkness Calling Festival. Is it going to be your first concert with the Sea At Midnight?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014It is actually going to be the first concert of The Sea At Midnight<\/strong>. Chris King is going to play guitar, Brandon Pierce is going to play drums and my nephew, Michael Baron, is coming in from Chicago to play bass. Pretty much my dream lineup. I was going to play guitar, but I\u2019m just going to sing. Feel like dancing and enjoying the music. Hopefully, the audience will too.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014Is \u201cOceans\u201d a song about sex?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014Ha! Well, I\u2019ve never specifically thought of \u201cOceans\u201d as a song about sex. I distinctively remember writing it. Came home from work on a Friday and was feeling lonely. Had a crush on this woman at work and really wanted to ask her out, but I didn\u2019t have any way of getting in touch with her, so knew I\u2019d be thinking about her over the weekend until I could see her again on Monday. Know I wrote the bulk of the lyrics on Friday night and it was finished by the end of the weekend. Felt writing it that it was about exploring the depth of my feelings for her. That emotionally I was being pulled towards her.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014And \u201cI can\u2019t wait\u201d seems like a love song, like \u201cAfterglow\u201d from the first record. What\u2019s your approach to this kind of song? More generic or do you think in someone when you are writing them?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014Sometimes they are more generic and I\u2019m not specifically thinking of anyone in particular while writing them and at other times they come from real world inspiration. \u201cI Can\u2019t Wait\u201d is actually from my little sister\u2019s perspective. I went to visit her in Ohio where she was going to college and she was really missing her boyfriend at the time, now her husband, who was back home in Chicago. The opening line, \u201cWell I\u2019m stuck here in Ohio and it\u2019s snowing on April Fool\u2019s\u201d really happened. I woke up in my hotel room intending to go for a run and when I opened the curtains it was snowing. Huge snowflakes slowly drifting down. You could hardly see anything. And it was April 1st. And my flight got cancelled.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014What can we expect of your second album?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014It will still have that, for lack of a better term, The Sea Of Midnight<\/strong> sound from the first album, but we have expanded the musical palette, so to speak, and we\u2019ve done some different things production-wise as well. Francois wrote in his review of the first single \u201cOceans\u201d that there is more of a shoegaze sound with prominent distorted guitars, which was completely on the mark. During the recording of the second album both Chris and myself were listening to a lot of shoegaze, in particular Swervedriver<\/strong>, and I was listening to Catherine Wheel<\/strong> quite a bit, so we felt like playing more distorted guitar parts and pushing them in the mix. There are female background vocals on that song as well courtesy Marisa Shirar, which is a first. Also, there is saxophone on the record. I was listening to a lot of early Furs<\/strong> while recording the album and I was struck that one of the pioneers of postpunk had a full time saxophone player, so sax is featured on a few songs, which is another first.<\/span><\/p>\n

One of the biggest production changes was I wanted the vocals more up front on this album. Think on the debut they are a little buried. That was my mistake. It was a stylistic decision, but on this record I really want them to be more prominent in the mix.<\/span><\/p>\n

\u2014Any possibility of another physical edition of the first album only released on cassette? And the new one?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2014The first album is actually available on cassette from Velouria Recordz. You can order it from their Bandcamp page. I\u2019m not sure I\u2019ll be able to afford a physical release of the new one. My music is entirely self-funded. I pay for all the recording, mastering, promotion, etc. and it gets to be pretty expensive. Plus, I just purchased a bunch of new musical gear. A new guitar, a bunch of guitar pedals, pedalboard and other equipment. I\u2019d like to get a new amp too, so not sure after the recording and mastering there will be a budget left over for a physical release of any sort.<\/span><\/p>\n